[A. Call to Order] [00:00:14] >> GOOD EVENING, I AM CALLING TO ORDER THE BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS REGULAR MEETING FOR MONDAY AUGUST 24TH. WOULD YOU PLEASE RISE FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. ALL RIGHT ROLL CALL PLEASE. >> DENNIS LOCKWOOD. [D. Approval of Minutes and Findings of Facts of Previous Meetings] KEVIN RIDER, BRAD KRAY CRABO? >> PRESENT. >> WE HAVE FROM THE HEARING OFFICER AND REGULAR HEARING, WE WILL ENTERTAIN. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS OR CHANGES TO THE MINUTES? IF NOT COME I WILL ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO APPROVE. >> MOVE TO APPROVE. >> SECOND. >> ALL IN FAVOR? >> AYE. >> OKAY, LET'S SEE. COMMUNICATIONS BILLS AND EXPENDITURES, ANYTHING TO [F. Reports, Announcements, Legal Counsel Report, and Department Concerns] REPORT? >> I HAVE NOTHING TO ADD GOOD. >> OKAY, THANK YOU. ANY REPORTS ANNOUNCEMENTS? LEGAL ANNOUNCEMENT REPORT? >> I HAVE NOTHING EITHER. >> THANK YOU. I HAVE JUST A COUPLE OF ANNOUNCEMENTS. ONE IS THAT THE COUNCIL HAS NOW APPOINTED A NEW MEMBER OF THE BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS, IT IS NOT BRAD -- >> WHICH WE WOULD HAVE BEEN GLAD TO HAVE. >> IT IS RYAN CADWELL WHO WAS APPOINTED LAST WEEK. SO HE WAS NOT ABLE TO MAKE THIS MEETING. HE WILL BE AT THE NEXT MEETING I'M SURE A. AND THEN WELCOME BACK BRAD WHO IS JUST FILLING IN FOR THIS EVENING FOR CHRISTINE. [G. (V) Thompson Pickleball Court & Pergola Variances.] SO THANK YOU FOR BEING HERE. OKAY LET'S MOVE ON TO OUR PUBLIC HEARING. WE HAVE ONE THIS EVENING. SO IT IS THE THOMPSON PICKLEBALL COURT AND PERGOLA VARIANCES AT 11136 SAINT CHARLES PLACE IN KINGSWOOD. SEEKING VARIANCE FOR THE REAR WEST SETBACK. THE MINIMUM YARD SETBACK IS REQUIRED 35 FEET IS REQUIRED AND SIX TO 24 FEET IS REQUESTED. LOT COVERAGE OF 52%, MAX IS 35% AND THEN ALSO THE -- PUTTING THE PICKLEBALL COURT IN THE FRONT YARD, WHICH IS THE WEST YARD, WHICH IS THE BACK OF THE HOUSE. OKAY, SO THOSE ARE THE DOCKETS NUMBER PZ-2026-00039 V, 00041V AND 00052V. WILL YOU PRESENT. MAKE SURE YOU STATE YOUR NAME FOR THE RECORD. I AM SORRY, I SHOULD HAVE TOLD YOU. THERE YOU GO. >> MY NAME IS HEATHER ROUSH AND I AM PRESENTING BRETT THOMPSON, WE ARE CO-OWNERS OF THE PROPERTY WE ARE TALKING ABOUT. AND SO, WE ARE JUST ASKING FOR THE ONE THING AS YOU MENTIONED BEFORE IS THAT THE BACK OF THE HOUSE IS ACTUALLY CONSIDERED THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE BECAUSE THE BACK OF THE HOUSE FACES GRAY ROAD AND A COUPLE OF THINGS HAVE CHANGED PROBABLY SINCE THE DOCUMENTS IN THE HOA MEETING THIS MONTH, THEY APPROVED THAT THE HOA WILL BE FULLY RESPONSIBLE FOR THE PRIVACY FENCE THAT RUNS ALL THE WAY DOWN GRAY ROAD AND PRIOR TO THIS IT WAS OF SUBJECT TO THE PROPERTY OWNER. SO THAT FENCE WILL BE REPLACED. AND IT WILL BE THE SAME ALL THE WAY DOWN GRAY ROAD AND WILL GO FOR THE UPKEEP. AND THAT'S THE REAR YARD AT THE WEST SIDE AND NOT THE FRONT YARD, SO WE ARE ASKING FOR APPROVAL FOR THE PICKLEBALL COURTS AND THE PERGOLA. AND THEY ARE FOR PRIVATE USE. I KNOW THAT WAS SOMETHING ELSE THAT WAS IN QUESTION. IT IS FOR THE FAMILY AND NOT FOR PUBLIC PLAY. [00:05:06] >> ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU SPEAKER THE PICKLEBALL COURT, AS YOU PROBABLY KNOW, THEY HAVE ALREADY BEEN BUILT. AND THAT WE DID NOT KNOW THAT WE WERE OUT OF COMPLIANCE. WE HAD APPROVAL FROM THE KINGSWOOD HOA AND KINGSWOOD ALSO USES THE THIRD PARTY COMPANY AND KIRKPATRICK APPROVED THE COURTS AND THE PERGOLA AS WELL. THAT'S ALL I HAVE. >> GREAT. YOU CAN GO AHEAD AND HAVE A SEAT. IS THERE ANYONE HERE TO SPEAK IN SUPPORT OF THIS REQUEST? THIS PETITION? ALL RIGHT, ANYONE HERE TO SPEAK AGAINST IT? LET'S HAVE THE DEPARTMENT REPORT, PLEASE. >> THANK YOU. AS YOU CAN SEE IN THE STAFF REPORT, WE INCLUDED A RECENT AERIAL PHOTO OF THE SITE JUST SHOWING HOW MUCH IS GOING ON IN THAT BACKYARD AREA. AS FAR AS THE WEST SETBACK, THIS IS A THROUGH LOT. SO IT HAS TWO FRONT YARDS, ONE ON THE EAST END ONE ON THE WEST SIDE. SO THAT'S JUST A MATTER OF FACT OF HOW THE ORDINANCE LOOKS AT A THROUGH LOT HAVING TWO FRONT YARDS. AS FAR AS LOT COVERAGE, THEY ARE REQUESTING A 17% INCREASE UP TO 52% AND THEY WILL NEED TO WORK WITH THE CARMEL ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT TO GET APPROVALS FOR GRADING AND DRAINAGE AND THINGS LIKE THAT. AS FAR AS THE PICKLEBALL COURT LOCATION COME AGAIN COME IT IS REQUIRED TO BE IN A SIDE OR REAR YARD AND AGAIN, THE WEST YARD IS CONSIDERED A FRONT YARD AGAIN. SO I WOULD SAY THE MAJOR ISSUE IS JUST THE LOT COVERAGE THERE THERE ARE A FEW EASEMENTS IN THAT BACK YARD AREA FOR THESE CONCRETE AREAS ALSO ENCROACHING INTO. THERE IS A 35-FOOT WIDE EASEMENT AND A WALL MAINTENANCE EASEMENT THAT RUN ALONG THAT WEST PROPERTY LINE. AS FAR AS THE HISTORY OF THIS PROJECT GOES, AS A PETITIONER STATED, THEY DID NOT KNOW THAT THEY NEEDED A PERMIT TO, SO THERE WAS A STOP WORK ORDER ISSUED IN 2020 FOR, AND THEN THAT KIND OF TRIGGERED SLOWLY TRYING TO GET THE OWNERS TO COME INTO COMPLIANCE. AND THERE IS A BUILDING PERMIT STILL PENDING AND IF THE VARIANCES ARE GRANTED THIS EVENING, WE ASK THAT THE BUILDING PERMIT ALSO MOVE FORWARD WITH ADDRESSING COMMENTS AND FINISHING OUT THAT PROCESS. PLANNING STAFF HAS A SLIGHT CONCERN ABOUT THE NOISE THAT COMES ALONG WITH PICKLEBALL. SO WE ASK THAT THE COMMISSIONER TALK ABOUT THE INTENSITY OF PLAY OR USE OF THE COURT. OVERALL PLANNING STAFF GENERALLY SUPPORTS THE REQUEST AS LONG AS THE PETITIONER WORKS WITH THE CARMEL ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT ON THE STORMWATER APPROVALS AND ALSO ADDRESSES ALL REMAINING REVIEW COMMENTS. AND THEN ALSO WITH THAT, WE SUGGEST THE ADOPTION OF THE FINDINGS OF FACT. AND THEN ALSO BEFORE I FINISH, WE DO HAVE REPRESENTATIVES HERE FROM THE BUILDING PERMITS DEPARTMENT AND ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT IN CASE YOU HAVE QUESTIONS FOR THEM. >> THANK YOU. BOARD MEMBERS, DO WE HAVE SOME QUESTIONS FOR THE PETITIONER? >> PLEASE, AND STAFF REALLY QUICK. DO WE HAVE ANY OTHER PICKLEBALL COURTS IN PRIVATE NEIGHBORHOODS? >> NOT THAT I KNOW OF IN ANYONE'S BACKYARD. MAYBE IN A COMMON AREA. >> HAVE YOUR NEIGHBORS EVER HEARD OF PICKLEBALL? I MEAN THAT IN THE NICEST OF WAYS. IT WILL MAKE YOU CRAZY IF IT IS NEXT DOOR. >> I ALSO THINK, GRAY ROAD IS PRETTY NOISY. >> IT IS. >> YOU CAN'T ENJOY THE BACKYARD. >> THEY ARE NOT HERE. I AM JUST SHOCKED. >> WE ACTUALLY HAVE SIGNED PETITIONS AND WE DID ANOTHER SIGNED PETITION TODAY AND APPROVAL OF IT FOR ALL OF THE ADJACENT PROPERTIES IN THE CUL DE SAC THAT ALSO WITH THE HEAVY RAINS THAT WE INCURRED THAT NOT A SINGLE PERSON'S YARD WAS AFFECTED WITH ALL THE RAINS. AND IF YOU KNOW WHERE KINGSWOOD IS LOCATED NEXT TO MARTIN MARIETTA I. DON'T THINK THAT OUR PICKLEBALL COURT COULD EVER DISRUPT MARTIN MARIETTA'S BLASTING. >> I HAVE BEEN THROUGH ALL OF THAT TOO. I JUST KNOW IF ONE WAS GOING IN MY NEIGHBOR'S YARD, WE WOULD PROBABLY HAVE A DISCUSSION. BUT NOBODY IS HERE. >> WE HAD A DISCUSSION BEFORE WE EVEN WENT TO THE HOA FOR APPROVAL, AND FROM EVERYONE. AGAIN IT'S ALL OF OUR ADJACENT PROPERTIES. >> YOUR NEIGHBORS ARE SAINTS. I JUST WANT TO SAY THAT. >> DENNIS, GO AHEAD. [00:10:08] >> YES, I'M NOT FAMILIAR WITH THE DINK NOISE. I DID NOT EXPECT MUCH OF THAT, BUT APPARENTLY IT IS SOMETHING. THIS IS A SITUATION WHERE I LOOK AT THE PROJECT, I SEE GRAY ROAD BEING A MAJOR THOROUGHFARE, THAT'S WHAT IT IS CALLED. THEN I THINK IN THAT SUBDIVISION, THERE MAY BE SIX OR SEVEN HOUSES THAT ARE ALONG THAT SECTION AND THE REST OF THE SUBDIVISION IS AFFORDED THE ABILITY TO HAVE A BACKYARD WHERE YOU ARE NOT. AND IT JUST SEEMS TO ME THE WAY THAT SUBDIVISIONS HAVE BEEN DESIGNED WHERE THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE AND THE FRONT YARDS ARE FACING THE INNER STREETS THAT I KNOW OUR ORDINANCE HAS REQUIREMENTS, BUT IT SURE SEEMS TO ME LIKE IN A SITUATION LIKE THIS WHERE YOU HAVE A MAJOR THOROUGHFARE AND THE IDEA IS TO BASICALLY TURN INWARD, THAT THAT WOULD NOT BE CONSIDERED A BACKYARD ANYWAY. I THINK UNDER THE CIRCUMSTANCES THAT THIS IS A FAIR ASSESSMENT OF WHAT YOU WANT TO DO. AND I AM SUPPORTIVE OF IT. >> YEAH, WE HAD NO IDEA. I TOTALLY THOUGHT IT WAS THE BACKYARD. IT'S NOT LIKE LAKEFRONT PROPERTY. THAT'S THE ONLY OTHER THING I COULD THINK OF WAS IF IT EQUATES TO WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT. AND GRAY ROAD IS NOT A LAKE LAKEFRONT. >> MARTIN MARIETTA IS. >> AND GRAY ROAD IS A MAJOR THOROUGHFARE FOR A PUBLIC IN THE NEXT COUPLE OF YEARS. INSTEAD OF HAZEL VILLE, BUT ANYWAYS. >> INTO THE DEPARTMENT REPORT MENTIONS ITEM 4 ON SITE WATER RETENTION. THERE IS A NUMBER OF WAYS THAT THAT COULD BE RESOLVED, HAS THAT BEEN RESOLVED? >> THERE IS STILL IN CONVERSATIONS WITH THE ENGINEERING DEPARTMENT. IT CAN LOOK LIKE A LOT OF THINGS LIKE EXISTING PAVEMENTS, MAYBE ADDING IN A RAIN GARDEN. THERE ARE SEVERA OPTIONS THEY ARE LOOKING AT. SO THAT IS STILL IN THE WORKS. >> MAY I SPEAK? >> SINCE WE HAVE ENGINEERING HERE, DO YOU WANT TO COME UP? OH, SORRY. YOU ARE SITTING NEXT TO MIKE. SO I THOUGHT MAYBE. COULD YOU JUST GIVE US YOUR ASSESSMENT OF POINT, THANK YOU. >> OUR DEPARTMENT IS SUPPORTIVE OF THE VARIANCE AS LONG AS THERE IS ON SITE DETENTION IN THE THOROUGHFARE FUND OR HARD SURFACE AND WILLING TO WORK WITH THEM AND ACTUALLY WILL GO ON SITE IN THE NEXT TWO WEEKS TO DISCUSS FURTHER OPTIONS. >> AND PART OF OUR CORRESPONDENCE BACK AND FORTH, WE DID SAY THAT AGAIN WE HAD NO IDEA THAT WE WERE OUT OF COMPLIANCE. AND THAT IF WE NEEDED TO DO ANY TYPE OF REMOVAL OF CONCRETE THAT WE COULD SEE -- I MEAN, THAT COULD BE AN OPTION AS WELL. >> SO COULD ONE OF THE OUTCOMES BE THAT A PAYMENT IS MADE INTO THE FUND, BUT THERE IS STILL A DRAINAGE ISSUE? BECAUSE OF THE ADDITIONAL HARD SURFACE AREA? DOES THIS WATER FLOOD THE FENCE LINE OR RUN OUT INTO THE USE PATH ALONG GRAY ROAD? >> THAT'S A REALLY GOOD QUESTION AND THE RAINFALL WAS A GREAT EXAMPLE OF THAT. SO I DID CONTACT THE DRAINAGE ENGINEER TO LOOK AT THE 311 COMMENTS TO SEE IF ANYONE IN THE SURROUNDING AREAS HAD A COMMENT ON DRAINAGE ISSUES AND DID NOT HAVE ANYONE AS OF RIGHT NOW SAY THAT THERE WAS A DRAINAGE ISSUE. BUT YES IN THE CASE WHERE AN $8000 PAYMENT IS PAID INTO THE FUND AND WE DO SEE SOME TYPE OF DRAINAGE ISSUE, THEY WOULD STILL BE RESPONSIBLE. WE COULD STILL USE THAT MONEY TO HELP THEM CREATE SOME TYPE OF ON SITE DETENTION AS WELL TO HELP WITH THAT. >> THANK YOU. SO MY UNDERSTANDING, THE COURT IS ALREADY THERE. SO YOU HAVE A GOOD EXAMPLE THAT IT HAS RAINED A LITTLE BIT RECENTLY. >> THAT'S WHAT THIS IS RIGHT HERE, WE WENT TO THE NEIGHBORS. I KNOW IT LOOKS A LITTLE FUNKY, BUT THEY HAVE SIGNED ON THE BACK WITH THEIR ADDRESSES HERE THIS IS EVERYONE ON THE CUL DE SAC. SO 2010 AND THEN ST. CHARLES. WE WENT TO EACH PERSON AND JUST TO ASK THEM TO SIGN A DOCUMENT STATING THAT THEY ARE -- >> YOU HAVE DONE YOUR DUE DILIGENCE. THERE IS NO CRITICISM COMING ABOUT THIS. IT IS SHOCKING. >> YOU SAID SOMETHING ABOUT THE HOA REPLACING THE FENCE. IS THAT SCHEDULED? AND WHAT TIME DO YOU KNOW? >> THE APPROVAL WAS JUST THIS MONTH. [00:15:03] ACTUALLY THE MAYOR ATTENDED THE HOA MEETING AND I THINK SHE WAS PRETTY EXCITED ABOUT THE APPROVAL, BECAUSE WE HAVE KIND OF GONE BACK AND FORTH BUT IF YOU HAVE EVER GONE DOWN GRAY ROAD, THE FENCE IS NOT UNIFORM AND IS FALLING DOWN. THEY DID NOT GIVE A DATE. >> CAN YOU SAY IT INTO THE MICROPHONE FOR THOSE WATCHING AT HOME. >> SORRY, THE ALUMINUM POST AND MOSTLY OFF CEDAR. THAT'S WHERE THE MAYOR WAS CONCERNED ABOUT IF IT WAS UNIFORM AND HOW IT WOULD LOOK. >> OKAY, THANK YOU. ANY OTHER COMMENTS? IF NOT I CAN ENTERTAIN A MOTION. >> I WOULD MAKE A MOTION FOR A POSITIVE CONSIDERATION OF THE VARIANCE REQUEST WITH THE PETITIONER ADDRESSING ALL REMAINING REVIEW COMMENTS, WORKING WITH CARMELENGINEERING DEPARTMENT, ALSO WITH THE ADOPTION AND EFFECT. >> SECOND. >> AND THE FIRST AND SECOND, IS THERE ANY FURTHER DISCUSSION? OKAY. WE WILL VOTE. ALL IN FAVOR -- >> AYE. >> ANY OPPOSED? ALL RIGHTS, YOU ARE APPROVED. DO WE HAVE ANY NEW BUSINESS QUESTION ANY OLD BUSINESS? * This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.